Taxi Driver Online

how bad was that legal team for the taxi driver

the LA argued that they had not fettered themselves by the policy, but if you fail the DSA test you wont get a badge!

And everyone has to take it!

And if you dont like the DSA test you can take an equalivalent!


jeez almost as bad as Kelly v liverpool city council

regards

Captain cab

Does this not make it a condition of the licence

Amicus Union Warns High Court Case Could Halve the Number of London Cabs

Monday, November 29, 2004 8:01:00 PM ET
PRNewswire


LONDON, November 29 /PRNewswire/ --

Amicus the UK's biggest private sector union will today warn that a case going to the High Court in London could halve the number of licensed taxi drivers in London and lead to an unprecedented rise in illegal touts.

The case being heard at the High Court which centres around a Darlington based taxi driver could set a national precedent. The case of Darlington Borough Council v Malcolm Kaye centres on Darlington Borough councils refusal to grant Malcolm Kaye a Hackney carriage drivers licence, on the grounds that he failed to meet the council's requirement that he pass their own standard test, the DSA Driver Pass Certificate.

Currently the law requires licensed taxi drivers to pass a standard drivers test and to have had a licence for 12 months but Darlington City council have imposed their own test where the failure rate is over 50%. Should the council win the case it will allow local authorities to introduce their own standards across the UK.

Amicus Regional Officer, Gerry Huntley says,

"The outcome of this case could affect cabbies across the UK and the safety of the traveling public. A decision against Malcolm will be a decision in favour of illegal touts and bureaucracy gone mad.

Malcolm has been a cabbie for 37 years, he's never had a complaint or been involved in an accident. He's a victim of a mad cap test plucked out of thin air."

There are currently 250 000 licensed taxi drivers nationally and 42,000 in London. Tfl estimates that there are 10 000 illegal touts operating in London.

Amicus maintains that there is no evidence that taxi drivers as a group were more likely to be involved in accidents and that the DSA would lead to improved road safety.

The case could lead to thousands more illegal touts if similar tests are introduced. Rather than increasing passenger safety Amicus believes that the council's plan could actual put more passengers at risk as there would be fewer licensed cabs on the road paving the way for unregulated cabs to fill the gap.

Malcolm Kay has been driving a cab for 37 years and has never had an accident.

Amicus on behalf of Malcolm Kaye appealed the decision with the Darlington Magistrates Court, the case was referred to the High Court on July 13th, the council appealed the Magistrates decision and lost. The case begins at 10.00am Monday 29th November.
Amicus

is it any wonder they lost in the high court with scaremongering like this??

almost sounds like the T&G

hehe

Captain cab

I was just thinking theat the legal term CONSTANT AND PRACTICE could well be introduced to this argument.

I still don't see how this cannot be viewed as an implimentation of a condition of Licence.

If they were to say that drivers with more than 3 points, drivers that have had a complaint relating to their driving or have had an accident in the past 3 years needed to take this test then I think that would be more suitable than asking every driver to take this test, particularly when some of us have done the job for 10 years + and have a unbleamished record and licence.

I'm confident I would pass this test

well charlie this is what the judge said;



regards

Captain cab

however,

i think the judge misdirected, the guy appealed due to the change of his conditions of license, as the act states. It is therefore not a policy change but a change of conditions.

regards

Captain cab

I couldn't agree more Captain, and I suspect it would have [edited by admin] off the judge big time.

They should stick to the facts, it's not really that hard to do.

_________________
IDFIMH

But I thought it was reported that the council could not apply conditions to a HC licence, if this were to be true then the council couldn't enforce previous conditions nor change them, within law.

To make passing a DSA test part of the information gathering for the grant of a licence, to ensure the applicant is a "fit and proper" person checks through the CRB must be conducted, these checks must be repeated every 3 years a similar timescale to medical checks.

Does this therefore mean that a DSA driving test should be undertaken at regular intervals after the initial test is passed. If we need to check peoples "legal" history with the CRB, peoples health and fitness through a doctor every 3 years it would be fair to say that we should take a test to review our driving competance every so often as well.

Maybe the only people who don't want their driving skills tested are those that would fail the test .................. is it therefore not better to get these people out of the industry.

I suspect that the insurance companies will soon cotton onto this and inflate premiums for anyone who hasn't passed the DSA test.

They can attach conditions via new byelaws, but not as conditions in the same way PH conditions are attached.

It all depends on what the councils wants, but it would seem that you only have to show the DSA test certificate each year, in the same way as you show your DVLA driver's license. Not do the test every three or so years.

On that we agree.

_________________
IDFIMH

It would be interesting to see if the insurance comnpanys offered a discount to those that pass the taxi driver tests.
Then you could go for it in the areas that councils are scared stiff of starting it.

I think it more likely that prices will rise to those who haven't passed rather than a reduction to those who have.

The advocate for the Taxi Driver was Jill Brown.
The Advocate for the Council was Mr Grodzinski.

There is not a lot known about Jill Brown except that that she has co written a book on Human rights law.

According to the Website Sam Grodzinski is a founding committee member of the Human rights lawyers association of which I understand Cherrie Booth may well be a member. I don't know if they both work from the same chambers.

The case was always going to be a hard one to call, in the end it came down to the way this particular Judge Interpreted the two relevant sections.

The Judge has more or less stated that passing the National Driving test does not necessarily make you a fit and proper person to hold a Taxi or Private hire licence. If that is true? Then perhaps the National driving test should be made harder so it does include the proficiency to make you a fit and proper person. It would be far better to go down that road than to have councils making conditions of license through the back door.

What is to stop a council from saying, "in order for us to determine you are a fit and proper person, we need to know if you are a regular Church go'er and only a signed declaration from your Vicar will convince us that you are. lol

I know its absurd, but we have some absurd Councillors.

Best wishes

Is the criteria for being a "fit and proper person" not the same accross the country.

If Darlington introduce the DSA test within their criteria to assess a persons suitability to recieve a licence would that stand up in court if someone was to fail the test after driving taxis, without complaint, for a number of years and was unable to renew.

I read reports where people with very dubious pasts have recieved licenses through the courts when the councils have refused a licence because of criminal or driving convictions.

As is my stance on plates ........... I think that proper investigation should take place by the local authority, under National guidelines, into whether the applicant is a "fit and proper" person. If this is seen to be to expensive then fee's should rise accordingly.

If I were to refused a licence because I failed the DSA test I would possibly question the test through the courts as I have drove cars and motorbikes for 17 years without accident or endorcement, 12 of those years as a taxidriver ........................... good job I'm confident of being part of the 50% that would pass it.

its all about standards, local authorities and the trade should look to improve. to make the test mandatory is rather too much.

however, we dont know why this local authority have taken this draconian step, the local cab trade are extremely militant and are known to be, as previously stated, perhaps their etting their just desserts

regards

Captain cab