Taxi Driver Online

UK cab trade debate and advice
It is currently Fri May 01, 2026 4:17 pm

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 8:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:31 pm
Posts: 1761
Location: Commonsense Country
I know I always suggest that councils are best placed to decide, and when it comes to forming policies and general issues I stand by that, however certain specific issues leave me gobsmacked.

Some time ago a driver was out at work in a suburb of Gateshead where we have a rank for 2 cars. There are 8 pubs in this area and we have consistently been asking for more spaces as more than 20 taxis work that rank at weekend nights. We'll call this driver A.

It was on one of these nights when driver A had pulled onto a disabled bay, as the rank was full, noticing that 3 cars were on the opposite side of the road in a loading bay waiting to enter the rank when a place became available.

The driver noticed a car stopped on the road adjacant to his with the passenger and driver glaring at him, he was just about to pull his window down and ask if he could be of assistance when the car sped forward and parked in a space left on the taxi rank, we'll call this driver B. One of the cars that was waiting at the loading bay opposite had started turning, driver 1, across the road to fill the space and was blocking both sides of the carriageway, so he sounded his horn which caused the others to sound theirs, drivers 2,3,4 and 5.

Driver B got out of his car and began arguing with driver 1 which incited drivers 2,3 and 4 who got out of their vehicles and joined in the argument. Driver B was irate and claimed that he was disabled and was unable to get into a disabled bay because there was a taxi in it. He was shouting that all taxi drivers were a bunch of greedy barstewards and those involved here were all counts (can't put the real words he said but you get my gist).

It was at this point that driver A pulled up and asked driver B what the problem was ................. "Its fooking you winkers thinking you can fooking park wherever the fook you want, stopping decent people from fooking parking where they need to" (or similar) driver B shouted as he walked directly towards driver A. Not wanting to show that he was intimidated by driver B's aggression driver A said "Fook of man you fooking a-hole".

At this point because the road was blocked a panda car, with blue lights flashing, came on the scene and driver A approached the officer pointing out that the driver of the car causing the disturbance was driver B and he suggested that Driver B, because of his general attitude, could have been drinking, at this point driver B was entering the takeaway.

Driver A told one of the officers that he had called driver B a fooking a-hole because of the way he had conducted himself, the officer told driver A to go back to work and they would sort it out.

About 5 days later driver A got a call from Gatesheads LO asking him to attend his office as an allegation had been made against him, as driver A was on his way to his school run he said it would have to wait and enquired as to what allegations had been made. When the LO mentioned this incident driver A stated the situation as I have described it here.

A meeting was held between driver A and the council and the LO decided that the case would need to be heard before the Regulatory Committee.

On the date of the committee hearing driver A was there with his solicitor but there was no sign of driver B who's written statement was read out in his absence. During the questioning of driver A regarding his statement a councillor asked "why on earth did you suggest to the Police Officer that driver B had been drinking, what has that got to do with you, you have no right to make such a suggestion".

Driver B obviously could not be questioned regarding his statement as he wasn't there, even though there was questions arising from his statement.

The decision this kangaroo court made was to suspend driver A for a period of 7 days, driver A immediately stated he intended to appeal against this decision.

Just so that you know, driver A has held various licenses with our council for 23 years and has an unblemished record, he is an approved contractor with the council and is approved to conduct sensitive contracts. He seeks work for his WAV and has built up a decent customer base of disabled users who he takes great pride in servicing.

I think that driver B has some kind of influence over a councilor or is being influenced by someone else to see this complaint through to the conclusion where driver A loses his licence.

I think that the "punishment" is unfair and an appeal before the magistrates may be beyond his reach financially.

The Police also received a complaint and driver A has been issued with a fixed penalty notice for an offence under section 5 public order, which he will appeal against as it will not have a financial impact if it gets through the CPS to court ............... indications are that it may not get that far.

The purpose of me posting this is to warn drivers that honesty is not always the best policy and it is with much regret that I have informed our members that they should initially deny all knowledge of any allegations made against them, at least until they have full knowledge of such allegations.

B. Lucky :D

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 9:23 pm 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57350
Location: 1066 Country
GA wrote:
I think that the "punishment" is unfair and an appeal before the magistrates may be beyond his reach financially.

Of course it's unfair and I suspect happens regulary the length and breadth of this country. :sad:

If the chap making the accusation didn't front up at the committee meeting, then the council should have ignored the contents of his statement.

It's an utter disgrace that the driver in front of the committee wasn't able to question in person his accuser. :sad:

It's a shame the chap doesn't have the money to contest this pi** poor decision. And maybe a bigger shame that drivers are at each other throats. :sad:

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 9:41 pm 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57350
Location: 1066 Country
GA wrote:
The purpose of me posting this is to warn drivers that honesty is not always the best policy and it is with much regret that I have informed our members that they should initially deny all knowledge of any allegations made against them, at least until they have full knowledge of such allegations.

I think keeping ones gob shut is the only way.

As for the situation that caused this problem, I would have ignored the soppy old sod in the motor. He wanted a ruck, and he got it.

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 9:44 pm 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57350
Location: 1066 Country
GA wrote:
The decision this kangaroo court made was to suspend driver A for a period of 7 days, driver A immediately stated he intended to appeal against this decision.

All the time I have got a hole in my ar** I will never agree that it's legal for a council to ban a driver for seven days. [-X

If a council deems someone not to be fit and proper, then take his license away full-stop. Someone doesn't suddenly become fit and proper in a week. :shock:

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 10:09 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 26, 2006 8:26 pm
Posts: 961
Location: Plymouth Devon
Sussex wrote:
And maybe a bigger shame that drivers are at each other throats. :sad:


Agreed but as you have seen lately its in every industry that involves lots of drivers, bloody shame really as united we stand and divided we fall :shock:

_________________
Legal and proud

Loads a love from BERTIE !!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 6:33 am 
GA wrote:
I know I always suggest that councils are best placed to decide, and when it comes to forming policies and general issues I stand by that, however certain specific issues leave me gobsmacked.

Some time ago a driver was out at work in a suburb of Gateshead where we have a rank for 2 cars. There are 8 pubs in this area and we have consistently been asking for more spaces as more than 20 taxis work that rank at weekend nights. We'll call this driver A.

It was on one of these nights when driver A had pulled onto a disabled bay, as the rank was full, noticing that 3 cars were on the opposite side of the road in a loading bay waiting to enter the rank when a place became available.

The driver noticed a car stopped on the road adjacant to his with the passenger and driver glaring at him, he was just about to pull his window down and ask if he could be of assistance when the car sped forward and parked in a space left on the taxi rank, we'll call this driver B. One of the cars that was waiting at the loading bay opposite had started turning, driver 1, across the road to fill the space and was blocking both sides of the carriageway, so he sounded his horn which caused the others to sound theirs, drivers 2,3,4 and 5.

Driver B got out of his car and began arguing with driver 1 which incited drivers 2,3 and 4 who got out of their vehicles and joined in the argument. Driver B was irate and claimed that he was disabled and was unable to get into a disabled bay because there was a taxi in it. He was shouting that all taxi drivers were a bunch of greedy barstewards and those involved here were all counts (can't put the real words he said but you get my gist).

It was at this point that driver A pulled up and asked driver B what the problem was ................. "Its fooking you winkers thinking you can fooking park wherever the fook you want, stopping decent people from fooking parking where they need to" (or similar) driver B shouted as he walked directly towards driver A. Not wanting to show that he was intimidated by driver B's aggression driver A said "Fook of man you fooking a-hole".

At this point because the road was blocked a panda car, with blue lights flashing, came on the scene and driver A approached the officer pointing out that the driver of the car causing the disturbance was driver B and he suggested that Driver B, because of his general attitude, could have been drinking, at this point driver B was entering the takeaway.

Driver A told one of the officers that he had called driver B a fooking a-hole because of the way he had conducted himself, the officer told driver A to go back to work and they would sort it out.

About 5 days later driver A got a call from Gatesheads LO asking him to attend his office as an allegation had been made against him, as driver A was on his way to his school run he said it would have to wait and enquired as to what allegations had been made. When the LO mentioned this incident driver A stated the situation as I have described it here.

A meeting was held between driver A and the council and the LO decided that the case would need to be heard before the Regulatory Committee.

On the date of the committee hearing driver A was there with his solicitor but there was no sign of driver B who's written statement was read out in his absence. During the questioning of driver A regarding his statement a councillor asked "why on earth did you suggest to the Police Officer that driver B had been drinking, what has that got to do with you, you have no right to make such a suggestion".

Driver B obviously could not be questioned regarding his statement as he wasn't there, even though there was questions arising from his statement.

The decision this kangaroo court made was to suspend driver A for a period of 7 days, driver A immediately stated he intended to appeal against this decision.

Just so that you know, driver A has held various licenses with our council for 23 years and has an unblemished record, he is an approved contractor with the council and is approved to conduct sensitive contracts. He seeks work for his WAV and has built up a decent customer base of disabled users who he takes great pride in servicing.

I think that driver B has some kind of influence over a councilor or is being influenced by someone else to see this complaint through to the conclusion where driver A loses his licence.

I think that the "punishment" is unfair and an appeal before the magistrates may be beyond his reach financially.

The Police also received a complaint and driver A has been issued with a fixed penalty notice for an offence under section 5 public order, which he will appeal against as it will not have a financial impact if it gets through the CPS to court ............... indications are that it may not get that far.

The purpose of me posting this is to warn drivers that honesty is not always the best policy and it is with much regret that I have informed our members that they should initially deny all knowledge of any allegations made against them, at least until they have full knowledge of such allegations.

B. Lucky :D



If he's appealing against the Councils decision to revoke his badge by law the Council must give him his badge back there and then, been there done it.


Top
  
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 9:23 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:31 pm
Posts: 1761
Location: Commonsense Country
Sussex wrote:
It's a shame the chap doesn't have the money to contest this pi** poor decision. And maybe a bigger shame that drivers are at each other throats. :sad:


Sussex the drivers are very much standing together, the accuser is a member of the public and is supposidly registered as disabled. I say supposidly as we have not seen his Blue Disabled badge, another point that could not be questioned (although we expect he probably is).

He has also been reported to the Police by the same person and after various interviews they have taken the minimum action against him, a fixed penalty under section 5 Public order. He will contest this at court as he can represent himself at no cost.

The driver concerned should have been in court this coming Friday but after being advised that the council would be seeking their costs his solicitor advised that the total costs could be over £5,000 if he should lose the appeal and then he would still lose a weeks wages.

His suspension started yesterday.

It appears that their is a strong possibility that the CPS will not take the case to court when he appeals the fixed penalty.

Maybe we will be able to put together some kind of appeal if the CPS decide to take no action ............... more channels are now available to us.

B. Lucky eusasmiles.zip

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 7:05 pm 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 7:30 pm
Posts: 57350
Location: 1066 Country
GA wrote:
Maybe we will be able to put together some kind of appeal if the CPS decide to take no action ............... more channels are now available to us.

I wish you and him well.

_________________
IDFIMH


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:40 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 1:49 am
Posts: 253
Location: Crawley
Lots of points here:
1 sounds like a good reason for us all to have legal costs insurance
2 the initial hearing in front of the council committee seems flawed by being in breach of "natural justice" ie having the chance to cross examine the accuser
3 what was the reason the council gave him a suspension..arguing, accusing Driver B of drinking , or occupying the disabled space
4 If it was the latter then the councils lack of action in providing adequate rank spaces would surely offer a reasonable defence
5 the threats by councils to get their legal costs is used by some councils to intimidate drivers, again I say get insurance

_________________
Our safety is Paramount


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 10:20 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:31 pm
Posts: 1761
Location: Commonsense Country
allo allo wrote:
Lots of points here:
1 sounds like a good reason for us all to have legal costs insurance
2 the initial hearing in front of the council committee seems flawed by being in breach of "natural justice" ie having the chance to cross examine the accuser
3 what was the reason the council gave him a suspension..arguing, accusing Driver B of drinking , or occupying the disabled space
4 If it was the latter then the councils lack of action in providing adequate rank spaces would surely offer a reasonable defence
5 the threats by councils to get their legal costs is used by some councils to intimidate drivers, again I say get insurance


I think it highlights the potential problems we face every day.

The compensation culture at its worst.

This driver has been suspended for arguing/swearing at a member of the public who was abusive himself, not just at the driver concerned but at anyone who was driving a taxi in the area.

As far as his legal representation is concerned I would prefer not to comment at this time, as we don't think anything about this case was properly dealt with and so see a lot of grounds for appeals at different levels.

As I have said more avenues are available to us and I doubt the Kangaroo Court will precide over such a case again.

B. Lucky :D

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2003 9:30 pm
Posts: 990
Location: The Global Market
So was Driver B in a taxi?

Or was he a member of public looking fto park in a disabled parking space?

Whatever, A was clearly wrong to parkin a disabled parking space.

_________________
A member of the Hire or Reward Industry


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 8:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:31 pm
Posts: 1761
Location: Commonsense Country
Tom Thumb wrote:
So was Driver B in a taxi?

Or was he a member of public looking to park in a disabled parking space?

Whatever, A was clearly wrong to parking a disabled parking space.


No driver B was a member of the public.

I don't have a problem with the member of the public complaining what I have a problem with is that he did not appear to substantiate or answer questions relating to the lies he told within his complaint and statement.

The other things I have a problem with is the specific councillors remark that driver A had no right to suggest to the Police that driver B had been drinking and the severity of the punishment for a driver with 23 years unblemished history.

I accept that this bloke could not get parked in the disabled bay, however I believe that if the bay had been taken by another disabled driver he would have parked on the taxi rank anyway. I must also add that no-one has had sight of this blokes blue disabled parking permit ............. we just have his word that he actually has one.

It is unjustifiable......................... and those involved have definitely not heard the end of the matter.

B. Lucky :D

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: power of the LA's
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 2:13 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 6:59 pm
Posts: 354
Can you imagine anything more bizzzare than this, a hackney is waiting at a red light on a pelican crossing the light goes green but the perestrians keep walking across, he starts to move forward sounds his horn and drives through the gap which they then leave, a lady who is standing on the pavement who is not wanting to cross the road but who just happens to be a councillors wife, takes his number and reports him as not being a fit and proper person to drive a taxi in our fair city. He gets a letter from the Licensing manager explaing that no further action will be taken however when he asks for the councillors name he cannot have it under the data protection act, so once again the chips are firmly stacked against us.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: power of the LA's
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 4:20 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 4:31 pm
Posts: 1409
Location: Grim North, Carrot Crunchers and Codhead Country, North of Watford Gap
the thinker wrote:
Can you imagine anything more bizzzare than this,.


Yes I can

A York Stn taxi picked up a Councillor, [councillor unknown to the driver], the driver was running tarriff 2, most do [stn taxis]running during the day on tarriff 2 to make their money back from the Stn permits fees

The Councillor rang Stn Taxis to complain

Stn Taxis said can you come into the office and file your complaint against the driver, Oh, we can send you a taxi to pick you up to come into the office, to which they did, and dispatched a taxi

A Stn driver picked up this Councillor to take him to the Stn taxi office, he also had it meter on tarriff 2 [during the day] is that takin the p^ss or wot

I also hear that Stn Taxis now do all taxi complaints, take the instance of one driver argueing with a member of the public over a parking matter, stn taxis committee gave him a 4 week suspension order, not to work, but this matter could go to appeal at stn taxis committee

guess where the appeal was held, at a stn taxi member's house over a cup of coffee, whereas he got the ban reduced
bizzare
You coudn''t make this up, bizzare really bizzare


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: power of the LA's
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:06 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:53 pm
Posts: 10381
Stinky Pete wrote:
Stn Taxis said can you come into the office and file your complaint against the driver, Oh, we can send you a taxi to pick you up to come into the office, to which they did, and dispatched a taxi


Anyone wishing to work York Station should realise by now that the contractor issuing the permits can apply any condition they want in respect of those permits. If you guys in York want to stuff this outfit then your going to have to stop buying permits, its as simple as that.

Overcharging is an offence, if anyone feels the need to charge a higher tariff than the one they are legally obliged to charge, then they can't really complain if they get caught out.

Regards

JD


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Cerberus, Sussex and 531 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group