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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 8:22 pm 
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Skull wrote:
Strangely enough Sussex, I didn't have you pegged as someone who believed in the big juju in the sky. #-o

Not saying I do, but I don't rip the pi** out of those that do.

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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 8:35 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
Skull wrote:
Strangely enough Sussex, I didn't have you pegged as someone who believed in the big juju in the sky. #-o

Not saying I do, but I don't rip the pi** out of those that do.


Ah but you are not saying you don't either. #-o So what supernatural being floats your boat? Personally, I found the Big juju in the sky, Santa Clause and the tooth fairy a bit of a stretch, and I think that's why I became an atheist. :)


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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 8:55 pm 
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Skull wrote:
So you don't see hacking peoples heads off as enough of an introduction to religion? What do you suggest, throwing people to the Lions just to wet a youngster's appetite?


I wouldn't suggest that kind of thing as an introduction to religion but it may suggest that somebody has lost the plot, essentially most religions were used as a way to police peoples morals and to have some form of law in the early years. Hopefully it can progress for those that wish to belong to a religion. Just because somebody studies religion it does not follow that they will become some kind of zealot or a fundamentalist, religion is followed throughout history and explains why a lot of things happened and generally is the reason for some considerably bad behaviour but generally most people just want to live what they perceive to be a good and wholesome life. I don't see the problem with children learning about religions so long as they learn about all of them, the good with the bad and the history of the said religion. I think I'd be happier if children weren't forced to practice a particular religion until they are old enough to make up their own mind but unfortunately that's not going to happen as parents have their childrens welfare at heart and if they believe that a particular religion is the right way forward there is little the state can do about it. The state however should not be funding individual schools of faith. It seems to me that you appear to have little empathy with people that have chosen a religious way of life but it is their life, let them live it.

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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 9:14 pm 
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toots wrote:
Skull wrote:
So you don't see hacking peoples heads off as enough of an introduction to religion? What do you suggest, throwing people to the Lions just to wet a youngster's appetite?


I wouldn't suggest that kind of thing as an introduction to religion but it may suggest that somebody has lost the plot, essentially most religions were used as a way to police peoples morals and to have some form of law in the early years. Hopefully it can progress for those that wish to belong to a religion. Just because somebody studies religion it does not follow that they will become some kind of zealot or a fundamentalist, religion is followed throughout history and explains why a lot of things happened and generally is the reason for some considerably bad behaviour but generally most people just want to live what they perceive to be a good and wholesome life. I don't see the problem with children learning about religions so long as they learn about all of them, the good with the bad and the history of the said religion. I think I'd be happier if children weren't forced to practice a particular religion until they are old enough to make up their own mind but unfortunately that's not going to happen as parents have their childrens welfare at heart and if they believe that a particular religion is the right way forward there is little the state can do about it. The state however should not be funding individual schools of faith. It seems to me that you appear to have little empathy with people that have chosen a religious way of life but it is their life, let them live it.


Absolute borlocks.

Religion is not about faith. It's about control. It's about dressing the public in fear, as an instrument of controlling them.

The Crusades weren't about faith, they were about empire and control of it.

Islam was born of conflict. The split was Shia and Sunni. They loathe each other.

And I loathe them both equally.

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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 9:17 pm 
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toots wrote:
Skull wrote:
So you don't see hacking peoples heads off as enough of an introduction to religion? What do you suggest, throwing people to the Lions just to wet a youngster's appetite?


I wouldn't suggest that kind of thing as an introduction to religion but it may suggest that somebody has lost the plot, essentially most religions were used as a way to police peoples morals and to have some form of law in the early years. Hopefully it can progress for those that wish to belong to a religion. Just because somebody studies religion it does not follow that they will become some kind of zealot or a fundamentalist, religion is followed throughout history and explains why a lot of things happened and generally is the reason for some considerably bad behaviour but generally most people just want to live what they perceive to be a good and wholesome life. I don't see the problem with children learning about religions so long as they learn about all of them, the good with the bad and the history of the said religion. I think I'd be happier if children weren't forced to practice a particular religion until they are old enough to make up their own mind but unfortunately that's not going to happen as parents have their childrens welfare at heart and if they believe that a particular religion is the right way forward there is little the state can do about it. The state however should not be funding individual schools of faith. It seems to me that you appear to have little empathy with people that have chosen a religious way of life but it is their life, let them live it.


That's quite a well balanced piece. However, did you consider that the parents might be brainwashed and as a consequence, they are doing the same to their children. In the misguided belief, they are policing their children's morals. It also suggests that you cannot be a morally guided person without belief in a religion and I don't think that could be further from the truth. As I don't see many Atheists hacking people to death in the street, as they find it morally abhorrent. :-|


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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 9:44 pm 
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Skull wrote:
captain cab wrote:
I'd say anyone putting images of the prophet on TDO obviously doesn't like TDO very much - please remove the image.


It's a cartoon, and that's the whole point. Why should a cartoon be a problem to anyone? #-o Don't tell me you of all people CC, are being sucked into this nonsense. #-o

What about the Catholic cartoon of the pedophile priests?

So Islam is to be give a privileged position here in the UK, so we are, in fact, living in an Islamic state? #-o #-o #-o #-o

You've got it in one.

We've sleep-walked into it.

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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 10:01 pm 
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Brummie Cabbie wrote:
Skull wrote:
captain cab wrote:
I'd say anyone putting images of the prophet on TDO obviously doesn't like TDO very much - please remove the image.


It's a cartoon, and that's the whole point. Why should a cartoon be a problem to anyone? #-o Don't tell me you of all people CC, are being sucked into this nonsense. #-o

What about the Catholic cartoon of the pedophile priests?

So Islam is to be give a privileged position here in the UK, so we are, in fact, living in an Islamic state? #-o #-o #-o #-o

You've got it in one.

We've sleep-walked into it.


Well maybe the backlash from this young soldier being murder will address the balance. We can only live in hope, because if it doesn't, and there are any more killings of this kind, everything is going to blow apart at the seams.

Mark my words, if the Muslim community can't stop these atrocities and the government fails to take decisive action. Things are going to get out of control very quickly. :-|


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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 10:49 pm 
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seek out the extremists an a lot of problem will go away

no need tar brush all with same brush

hopeful in 30 year all this will be laughed at as the strict islamic code dies off with the elders and the new gen choose to be british

bit i find poor is the man in street think of asian when say muslim yet them that did this were african an i think they use muslim as excuse when it really racial hate crime an something that happen daily in africa


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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 11:28 pm 
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Tico wrote:
seek out the extremists an a lot of problem will go away

no need tar brush all with same brush

hopeful in 30 year all this will be laughed at as the strict islamic code dies off with the elders and the new gen choose to be british

bit i find poor is the man in street think of asian when say muslim yet them that did this were african an i think they use muslim as excuse when it really racial hate crime an something that happen daily in africa


Ignorance is not a colour but a state of mind. I am all for diversity and living in harmony by enriching peoples lives, but the Islamic state of GB, is not what I had in mind. :-|

I think it's time for Islam to drag itself into the 21st century, if it wants to remain in this country. :-|


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PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 6:12 am 
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Skull wrote:
toots wrote:
Skull wrote:
So you don't see hacking peoples heads off as enough of an introduction to religion? What do you suggest, throwing people to the Lions just to wet a youngster's appetite?


I wouldn't suggest that kind of thing as an introduction to religion but it may suggest that somebody has lost the plot, essentially most religions were used as a way to police peoples morals and to have some form of law in the early years. Hopefully it can progress for those that wish to belong to a religion. Just because somebody studies religion it does not follow that they will become some kind of zealot or a fundamentalist, religion is followed throughout history and explains why a lot of things happened and generally is the reason for some considerably bad behaviour but generally most people just want to live what they perceive to be a good and wholesome life. I don't see the problem with children learning about religions so long as they learn about all of them, the good with the bad and the history of the said religion. I think I'd be happier if children weren't forced to practice a particular religion until they are old enough to make up their own mind but unfortunately that's not going to happen as parents have their childrens welfare at heart and if they believe that a particular religion is the right way forward there is little the state can do about it. The state however should not be funding individual schools of faith. It seems to me that you appear to have little empathy with people that have chosen a religious way of life but it is their life, let them live it.


That's quite a well balanced piece. However, did you consider that the parents might be brainwashed and as a consequence, they are doing the same to their children. In the misguided belief, they are policing their children's morals. It also suggests that you cannot be a morally guided person without belief in a religion and I don't think that could be further from the truth. As I don't see many Atheists hacking people to death in the street, as they find it morally abhorrent. :-|


My point regarding morals and religion is that most of our first laws came from religious beliefs. I did of course consider that the parents may well have had a strict religious upbringing, but, one can't expect the state to dictate how you bring your child up it would be the ultimate 'nanny state' if we did. We live in a society that allows freedom of our own thoughts and it would be wrong to censor what we think and believe, we can only hope that people stay within the law with their actions. Obviously morality does not necessarily mean religious, you don't have to be religious to be a good person

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PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:04 am 
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Banning religion ? Go and live in China.Im atheist myself personally but i dont really care what someone else is as long as its good for them.In some ways i suppose im envious of the help and comfort it gives some people,bit like still beleiving in santa to me :D


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PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:31 am 
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They are not Muslim Terrorists. They are Schmucks

When was the last time that you heard a Methodist preacher apologize for one of his followers cutting off the head of a “non-believer? Has there been a case where a Black bishop has apologized for a member of his race raping a woman?

Then again, maybe you have heard of a Rabbi saying that the Jewish religion is embarrassed by a swindling stock dealer who just happened to be Jewish.

Nope. You have not heard these things happen because the leaders of the world’s religions and ethnic groups do not feel responsible for the antics of their brothers and sisters.

But every time a Muslim cuts off someone’s head, all Muslim leaders in the world, with the exception of the true loonies, immediately apologize and say that it is a conflict with the true meaning of the Koran.

There are two facts which have to be straightened out. One is that the Koran is a hateful document and when that is finally acknowledged by the Muslim world as a major cause for trouble, why not do a little copyediting to eliminate its venom?

The second item that needs attention is that Muslim leaders do not have to apologize or distance themselves from the evil ones. When a British soldier’s head is chopped off in London it has absolutely nothing to do with a Muslim living in New York City or a Muslim living in Nigeria.

No one has to apologize for anything. As a matter of fact, Muslims who do apologize are promoting the impression that there is some connection between the good Muslim and a bad Muslim. There certainly is not.

New Yorkers are constantly being asked by tourists who come to New York City, how do New Yorkers feel about the Muslims who live here in regards to the World Trade Center?

The response is that there is no connection at all and no real one hundred percent New York City Muslim has ever given us any reason to think differently.

One final thought. If you add up all the Muslims who have done criminal acts (portrayed by the media as terrorism), it is a drop in the bucket compared to the numbers of the general population of the world that murder, rape, swindle…


http://epistle.blogs.com/my_weblog/2013 ... y-are.html

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PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 11:45 am 
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No. They are Islamic terrorists. And the fact is, regardless of whatever religion terrorists claim to represent. It is the radicalised factions of these religions that hold the whip hand over everyone.

I have no problem with moderate Islam, but these radicals are living within Muslim community and frequenting their mosques. So spare me the BS, that they are not true believers acting in the Islamic faith.

This is an Islamic problem that can only be solved within the Muslim community, and that's not going to happen anytime soon by creating Faith Schools.

Oh and as for hacking a soldier's head off not being significant in the greater scheme of things, happening around the world, that might be true. However, it is not something I want to see happening on British streets, especially when I have a son serving in the Armed Forces.

I wish I had more time to answer the above, but I've got to jam...


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PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 5:39 pm 
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Thousands in Britain may be on the path to 'violent extremism', Home Secretary warns, as she slams the BBC for giving airtime to 'disgusting' hate preacher Anjem Choudary

Theresa May says 500 police investigating murder of Lee Rigby in Woolwich

  • She maintains 'all the indications' are execution was a lone wolf attack
  • Reveals 2,000 potential radicals spoken to by Government in past year
  • Home Secretary launches bid to force through 'essential' snooper's charter
  • Slams BBC for inviting Choudary onto Newsnight to give 'disgusting' views

Thousands of people living in Britain could be 'on the path' to becoming violent radicals and terrorists, the Home Secretary said today.

Theresa May gave the warning as she confirmed a fresh crackdown on extremist groups who could be a threat to national security.

The senior Tory also used an interview on the BBC's Andrew Marr Show to criticise the Corporation for interviewing radical cleric Anjem Choudary.

He was given star billing on a discussion panel with Newsnight presenter Kirsty Wark, as he insisted he was not a ‘hate preacher’ or Islamic extremist.

Refusing to condemn the killers of Lee Rigby, the British drummer crushed by a vehicle and then hacked to death with machetes, Choudary even suggested that ‘one man killed in a street’ was hardly proper vengeance for those killed by ‘Britain and the U.S.’ in wars overseas.

Mrs May said: 'I think Anjem Choudary has disgusting views and I think it is right that we look at how those views are being presented and I think there were many people who did indeed say "What is the BBC doing interviewing Anjem Choudary?"

After his appearance two days ago, the BBC was branded 'idiotic' and 'insensitive'.

Around 500 police and security officers are working on the 'horrific murder' of soldier Lee Rigby, Mrs May also revealed.

But despite more arrests linked to the killing overnight, she said 'all the indications' pointed to a lone wolf style incident rather than a wider planned operation.

Asked if she believed there were thousands at risk of radicalisation in the UK, she replied 'potentially'.

'We have people at different points on what could be the path to violent extremism,' she said.

She added that the Government 'Prevent' scheme designed to reduce radicalism in Britain had spoken to 2,000 people at risk in the past year, particularly in prison.

Mrs May also suggested a lower limit for imposing banning orders on extremist groups could be introduced.

She told the BBC's Andrew Marr Show: 'We do need to look at the powers, we do need to look at the laws.

'We do need to look, for example, at the question of whether perhaps we need to have banning orders to ban organisations that don't meet the threshold for proscription.'

Tighter rules could also be imposed on internet service providers, the Home Secretary suggested.

She added: 'One of the issues we need to look at is whether we have got the right processes, the right rules in place in relation to what is being beamed into people's homes.'

Mrs May defended the 'excellent' work of the security and intelligence agencies in the face of claims mistakes were made in the handling of the two suspects, identified as Michael Adebolajo, 28, and Michael Adebowale, 22, who were known MI5.

A childhood friend of Adebolajo has also claimed that the suspect was approached by MI5 six months ago and asked if he would work for the security service.

Mrs May refused to be drawn on the details of the case but said said the security services worked in a 'variety of ways. They will approach individuals from time to time,' she said.

Detectives have made three further arrests in connection with the brutal killing. Two men, aged 24 and 28, were detained at an address in south-east London yesterday, while a 21-year-old man was arrested in the street in Charlton Lane, Greenwich, all on suspicion of conspiracy to commit murder.

Police from the Counter Terrorism Command, supported by specialist firearms officers, used Tasers to detain two of them, the 21 and 28-year-old. They did not need hospital treatment.

Mrs May also insisted the failed 'snooper's charter' would be revived as she appeared to be gearing up for a fight with Liberal Democrats.

Earlier this month Deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg blocked the Home Secretary's plans for a communications bill that would have given police and security services access to records of individuals' internet use.

Labour former Home Secretary Alan Johnson said today he was 'absolutely passionately' a supporter of reforms and suggested it was a resigning issue for Theresa May if she could not get the changes into law by 2015.

Asked whether she would quit over the matter, Mrs May told the BBC's Andrew Marr Show: 'I have made my view very clear. We are now working through across the government what action we can take but I'm clear, the law enforcement agencies, the intelligence agencies need access to communications data and that is essential to them doing their job.'

The Home Secretary said there was a reference to the plans in the Queen's Speech.

She added: 'I have always been clear that access to communications data is essential for law enforcement agencies and the intelligence agencies.

'There is a reducing capability in relation to access to communications data.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z2UVmj0GY6

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PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 5:51 pm 
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Thousands in Britain may be on the path to 'violent extremism', Home Secretary warns, as she slams the BBC for giving airtime to 'disgusting' hate preacher Anjem Choudary



And whose fault is this?

For the past 20 years anyone who questioned the sanity of the mass immigration this country has been subjected to has been instantly cast aside as a racist. Be this through the EU or anywhere else in the world.

If people pointed out the additional cost in terms of translators required by local authorities, the NHS etc - people were told they were being racist.

If people pointed out East Europeans were being exploited and at the same time they were effectively widening the labour market forcing labour prices down - they too were cast as racist.

We have been told we should be proud that we're a multi cultural society - yet across the country we have effectively ghettos - shock horror - people who speak the same languages - people of the same religions prefer the company of their own. The British know this very well - in places such as Spain - there are British enclaves.

The problem is now - what are the politicians going to do about now the backlash has begun - and the politicians - snake like creatures - begin to turn their positions around. They want to give the police even more powers to deal with the nutters - powers which will of course be pretty useful for dealing with non nutters.

For the politicians to blame the media is sadly typical of politicians.

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