Taxi Driver Online

There appears to be a growing head of steam nationally of unions/associations wanting to fight this new fixed penalty system for touting.

Now I'm not convinced either way, but bearing in mind the gov increased last year the penalties a court could give to touts, I'm a tad perplexed they want to decrease them if given via a fixed penalty.

But the bottom line is do we think the fixed penalty system for touting will decrease the numbers of folks doing it?

Methinks not.

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IDFIMH

Nothing has changed as far as the law is concerned accept for the introduction of the notices, notices or a full prosecution is at the discretion of those handing them out but it will be easier to get a conviction under this system should the offender choose to go to court.

How many cases of touting have come before the courts in the last ten years?

The PDN notices don't only apply to London.

I think enforcement of touts just got a littlle better.

Regards

JD

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I find it difficult to understand why hackney carriage associations would wish to fight it but it is understandable why private hire associations would fight it. The prospect of a private hire driver having his license revoked by an LO for a touting penalty notice is in many cases a very live probability.

Regards

JD

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Copyright notice © The contents of this post are copyright of JD and are not to be reproduced outside of TDO without written permission.

Just so I get this right, and to save me doing as much research as you on this issue, are you saying;

i) That any fixed penalties are in addition to existing touting laws, in the same way as drunk and disorderly fixed penalties are in addition to 'normal' D&D offences?

ii) Although most fixed penalties don't flag up on a person's criminal antecedents, are you saying they will pop up on an Enhanced CRB?

If both the above are true, then IMO what's happening is a good move, and those national associations with the hump are wrong.

Rightly or wrongly it takes forever to take a person to court for touting, and non-payment. Because of this successful prosecutions are not a common occurrence.

In relation to touting, if those fixed penalties appear on a licensed driver's CRB, then the council should be in a far better position to act.

I would be interested to find out exactly why, other than the lack of consultation, why some people have the hump with the change.

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IDFIMH

Yes



Yes

Hers is an example from a 2007 swansea licensing committee meeting were a pdn was flagged up on a crb check.

18. LOCAL GOVERNMENT (MISCELLANEOUS PROVISIONS) ACT 1976 - PRIVATE HIRE DRIVER - NJH

The Head of Environmental Health reported that NJH had failed at the time of applying to renew his Private Hire Drivers Licence, to notify the Authority of a penalty notice for disorder.

In accordance with procedures relating to CRB checks, Members were provided with additional information in relation to NJH’s convictions.

NJH explained the background details and circumstances relating to his convictions and also answered questions of Members relating to the offences.



I don't know why people have the hump but perhaps they don't understand the changes? That would seem the most logical reason to me?

Regards

JD

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I'm looking at my enhanced disclosure and part does state;

Police records of Convictions, Cautions, Reprimands and Final Warnings.

CC

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Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
George Carlin

As comments can be left on someone's CRB reply to the council (i.e. charged but didn't go to trial), by the police even without a conviction, then it would be a tad daft if real convictions, in the shape of a fixed penalty, didn't make the CRB's reply to councils.

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IDFIMH

I agree, all of my convictions are missing from my CRB

CC

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Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
George Carlin

Recently I saw comments from the LTDA suggesting they had the hump real bad about this proposed change.

Can't for the life of me see why, in fact I'm amazed they aren't jumping for joy about them.

I have no doubt the number of fixed penalty touting tickets will dwarf the number of touting prosecutions. Maybe 100 to 1.

So if Boris is true to his 'one tout and you're out' policy, this will see 1000 of drivers losing their London PH licenses should they tout.

Or have I missed something?

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IDFIMH

Has anyone got any specific details of the general disquiet amongst the taxi trade regarding the introduction of these penalty notices?

Regards

JD

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whether this is true or false I do not know, but this is how it has been explained to me.
In 2008 the magistrates' courts were given powers that would allow them to take away the licence of a person found touting, a licence Hackney or private hire driver could lose their licence for up to three months, a person with no licence could even have his car scrapped.
the new legislation would do away with this and simply make it a fixed fine.

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Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!

You have missed nothing, in fact you have it spot on. The bottom line rests with the licensing body.

In theory it should work like this.

Penalty notice and you lose your license. End of story.

Regards

JD

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Copyright notice © The contents of this post are copyright of JD and are not to be reproduced outside of TDO without written permission.

I will gladly send you a copy of what I have received by e-mail. if you can tell me how?

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Justice for the 96. It has only taken 27 years...........repeat the same lies for 27 years and the truth sounds strange to people!

False. The statutory law hasn't changed. Any powers given to magistrates has nothing to do with the statutory law in this respect.

Regards

JD

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Copyright notice © The contents of this post are copyright of JD and are not to be reproduced outside of TDO without written permission.

I think that is the view that some are trying to convey, out of naivety or hidden agenda.

Nothing is changing the laws updated last year. The only change is an addition of the fixed penalty, not a substitution.

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IDFIMH