Taxi Driver Online

Where to start with this?

I mean, two taxi drivers racing back to Dundee over the bridge in the early hours? - that's never happened before. But normally it's just taxis and the odd boy racer around at that time, and it's generally safe enough. Not unusual at all to have cars steaming past you on the bridge in the early hours even if you're sitting around the limit.

And could just imagine two HCs getting into some kind of race, but if I'm heading into Dundee I'm never heading for the ranks, or whatever, so I just try to ignore it and let them get on with it.

But there are obviously a few daftie drivers who take it to the limits, and things go wrong.

Not entirely clear what's happened here, and it's maybe interesting that the speed limits are mentioned, but not the actual speeds of the cars involved. Of course, maybe the CCTV evidence wasn't sufficient to measure them, but you'd think that there would at least be some kind of estimation in evidence, but there's nothing stated here.

Anyway, the bridge is 50mph most of the way, although 60-70 not that uncommon in the early hours, which is when this happened.

But as per the Google view right at the bottom, there's a 30 limit which starts maybe quarter of a mile from where the bridge actually ends. But it's a very straight and generally uncongested stretch, so even during the day very few vehicles slow significantly from the 50 limit until they get nearer the off ramps, where the accident happened. So it must have happened around where the long 30mph stretch ends and the road veers to the left onto the off ramp, as in the bottom photo - the piece says debris almost hit a car heading to Fife, which would have been to the hard right of the photo, on the other side of the cones

But obviously it's a scenario where two lanes become one, and if drivers are side-by-side and won't give way to each other...


Taxi driver feared river plunge during Tay Road Bridge ‘race’


Image: DC Thomson

Thomas Naismith and fellow taxi driver Mohammed Iqbal had been driving side-by-side at high speeds towards Dundee.

A taxi driver who smashed into a barrier on the Tay Road Bridge had feared his car was going to plunge into the river below.

Thomas Naismith and fellow taxi driver Mohammed Iqbal had been driving side-by-side at high speeds towards Dundee in the early hours of the morning before the collision.

Prosecutors had accused the pair, aged 54 and 56 respectively, of racing each other on the bridge.

CCTV footage played during their trial at Dundee Sheriff Court showed Naismith’s car in the left hand lane on the 50mph stretch, with Iqbal’s vehicle indicating left while side-by-side.

Naismith’s car then accelerated, before colliding with the barrier on the slip-road to Perth, a 30mph zone.

A piece of the barrier flew into the air and narrowly missed a car travelling towards Fife.


Image: DC Thomson

First offender Naismith was found guilty of dangerous driving, while Iqbal was convicted of a lesser charge of careless driving.

Bridge race considered

Sheriff Gregor Murray said: “I am entirely satisfied beyond reasonable doubt that the two of you were travelling at an average speed grossly in excess of the appropriate limits.

“On the question of racing, racing connotes that one of you must have tried to get your vehicle to a certain point of the bridge before another.

“In Mr Naismith’s case, there is a clear example that is what he intended to do.

“There is no evidence that is what Mr Iqbal tried to do.

“The evidence is he flashed his indicator to come into the left hand lane and decided, quite correctly, he couldn’t do so and carried on at a grossly excessive speed.

“There is no evidence he tried to reach that point.”

Bridge plunge terror

Sheriff Murray added: “As Mr Naismith himself acknowledged, his fear was that he would crash through the barrier and would go into the river and that he can’t swim.

“He knows that as he was coming off the Perth slipway road he would require the appropriate speed and as evidence shows, he did not apply it.”

Naismith, of Gleneagles Street, Dundee, was convicted of driving dangerously on November 26 2022 on the Tay Road Bridge by travelling at excessive speeds, losing control of his vehicle, colliding with a barrier and causing extensive damage to both his vehicle and the barrier.

The driving of Kerrystone Court resident Iqbal was described as “utterly appalling” by the sheriff who found him guilty of the lesser charge of careless driving by driving at excessive speeds.

‘Catastrophic effect’ of licence loss

Doug McConnell, representing Naismith, said his client had been a taxi driver for 20 years and has been renting out his taxi plate since being suspended.

Iqbal was also suspended which, according to defence solicitor Ross Bennett, has had a “catastrophic effect” financially.

Both men are hoping to resume their careers as taxi drivers subject to further hearings with Dundee City Council’s licensing board.

The pair were each fined £500 and Naismith was disqualified from driving for 12 months.

Iqbal was handed a six-month ban.


The Tay Bridge off-slip towards Perth, where the crash happened. (Image: Google/DC Thomson)

https://www.google.com/maps/@56.4579365 ... ?entry=ttu

Well on that definition it certainly is a racetrack, then, all the time


Maybe he did perceive it that way, but by that point you're well clear of the water, and over dry land. In fact, it could well be more dangerous to come off the ramp at that point because the car would fall off the top of the ramp onto solid land with a significant drop, as opposed to hitting the water. Of course, if he can't swim then that's a different matter, and it would be absolutely Baltic in there, even for a swimmer. The bridge is well known for 'jumpers', and quite a few have been rescued over the years, or fished out of the water dead


Renting out his *plate*. Well that would be illegal

But interesting example of scenario whereby he's maybe deemed unfit to drive a taxi, but not to own and operate one

(I remember when I started in Dundee in the 1990s hearing of drunk drivers and the like who had had their badge revoked, but were still allowed to run one of the quotaed saloon HCs )


Well that will be interesting. (And it's the licensing committee, not board, which deals with liquor licensing...)

Resolved that I'd stop reading these AI rehashes, or whatever, but since I know the scenario quite well, couldn't resist reading this one. And interesting that it repeats the licensing *board* error, which points to a rehash of the Courier's piece (and it's the same photo, and I doubt any other mainstream outlet has covered it, at this stage at least). On the other hand, it uses the word 'judiciary', doesn't use the word 'sheriff' and doesn't specifically mention the sheriff Gregory Murray, instead looking like it avoids a specific mention and instead refers to the 'court's decision' a couple of times. (And show me any similar article in the Scottish context that uses the term 'judiciary' )


Dundee Taxi Drivers Fined, Banned After High-Speed Tay Road Bridge Incident

https://bnnbreaking.com/world/uk/dundee ... e-incident

Dundee taxi drivers Thomas Naismith and Mohammed Iqbal faced consequences for their roles in a high-speed incident on the Tay Road Bridge, leading to dangerous collision. The court's decision sends a clear message about the seriousness of dangerous and careless driving.

In a recent court ruling, Dundee taxi drivers Thomas Naismith, 54, and Mohammed Iqbal, 56, faced consequences for their roles in a high-speed incident on the Tay Road Bridge, leading to a dangerous collision. The early morning event saw Naismith convicted of dangerous driving and Iqbal of careless driving, both fined £500 with Naismith also receiving a 12-month driving ban and Iqbal a six-month ban.

Details of the Incident

The court reviewed CCTV footage displaying Naismith's vehicle accelerating in a 50mph zone before colliding on a slip-road to Perth, narrowly avoiding a disastrous outcome as debris narrowly missed another vehicle. Both drivers, with years of experience in the taxi industry, were found to be significantly over the speed limit, though evidence of racing was conclusive only for Naismith. This high-speed chase not only endangered their lives but also posed a serious risk to public safety.

Impact on the Drivers

The aftermath of the incident has been severe for both Naismith and Iqbal. Facing suspension, they have encountered financial difficulties, with Naismith renting out his taxi plate and Iqbal similarly affected. Their future within the taxi industry hangs in the balance, pending further hearings with Dundee City Council's licensing board. The incident serves as a stark reminder of the responsibilities that come with being a licensed taxi driver and the severe consequences of neglecting these duties.

Legal and Community Repercussions

The court's decision to fine and ban Naismith and Iqbal sends a clear message about the seriousness of dangerous and careless driving. It underscores the judiciary's commitment to upholding public safety and the rule of law. As the community reflects on this incident, there's a growing awareness and discussion around road safety, especially concerning professional drivers whose roles demand exemplary conduct on the roads.

This incident not only highlights the dangers of reckless driving but also serves as a cautionary tale for all drivers. The consequences faced by Naismith and Iqbal demonstrate the legal and personal ramifications of such actions, emphasizing the importance of adhering to traffic laws and prioritizing safety over speed. As Dundee reflects on this event, it is hoped that it will lead to a broader commitment to road safety, potentially saving lives in the future.

So accelerating is a crime now? That and the mention of the speed limit makes it sound like accelerating per se is a problem


Not sure if they were, actually...

Plenty mention of the limits, but nothing about precise speeds. The sheriff said the speeds were 'inappropriate', which doesn't specifically mean over the limit.

Anyway, even after reading about three of these 'AI' articles on trade related safety issues, there's definitely a kind of formula evident, and certain buzzwords and phrases.

So there's the official/police/council PR/comms-style stuff like a 'clear message about the seriousness of dangerous and careless driving'. Or the 'stark reminder of the responsibilities that come with being a licensed taxi driver'.

Then there's the stuff like:



Yes, the Dundee 'community' in the back street pubs and the like will be 'reflecting' on this for weeks

As for 'growing awareness' of road safety etc, that's the kind of cliche-ridden stuff I've been reading about for at least the last 40 years

Forgot to post this earlier, but the barrier collision must have happened approximately where the two cars are here, and the debris must have ended up at other side of the cones to the right, where the cars travelling to Fife would be...

So no evident danger of the taxi driver going into the water here, but it's a fair drop onto solid ground. So not sure which I'd prefer, if it was to happen

Certainly less chance of dying immediately, I'd guess if going into the River Tay. Then again, you'd be trapped in the motor(?), and it would be utterly Baltic, and you'd be fully clothed, and which would make it more difficult to keep afloat. Maybe better just to slow down a bit

https://www.google.com/maps/@56.4590664 ... ?entry=ttu

So were these numpties racing back to see who could get pole place on the ranks?

All for a £5 or £10 job.

_________________
IDFIMH

Not sure, precisely, if they were 'racing' as such, but not unusual to see drivers heading into Dundee in a huge hurry at that time of night

Sounds like they were both intending going down the Perth off ramp to the left, so both would need to be in left hand lane at that point - the two lanes become one unless heading for the Aberdeen off ramp, therefore...

But one was in the right hand lane (the careless driver) while they were side by side, and indicated to come across to the left lane, to get onto the Perth off ramp. Sounds like the one in the left lane (the dangerous driver) accelerated to stop the other driver, and hit the barrier.

So seems like the careless one was driving a tad aggressively, and the one who crashed took exception to it, and tried to accelerate to thwart him, but came out worst

Video on Courier's website, which has been released by the Crown Office

Not quite what I was expecting. Doesn't look like they were both intending using the Perth off-ramp at all, so that's my theory scuppered

So to that extent they weren't really getting in each other's way when two lanes became one onto the Perth off-ramp.

But no doubt they were both going well over the 30mph limit at that point (I'd guess more like 50 or 60 or even more), and just looks like the one who crashed was going too fast to negotiate the bend on the off-ramp, and thus hit the barrier.

And the 30mph zone (down from 50mph most of the bridge) begins maybe a quarter of a mile before the CCTV footage starts. So to that extent, if they were side by side prior to the footage starting and 'racing', then that's not discernible from what's in the video. The 'race' would have really been during the few hundred yards before the lanes split.

But, of course, even from the short distance covered by the video, not difficult to conclude that they were maybe driving, er, competitively, although obviously heading for different destinations, although maybe the 'lucky' driver only decided right at the end that it would be a better idea to continue onto the straighter Aberdeen off-ramp

(So maybe my theory was correct in that they did both intend using the Perth off-ramp, but at the last second the 'careless' driver kept going towards the Aberdeen ramp to avoid a collision, while the 'dangerous' driver was too late.)

And 2am on Saturday morning it happened, thus certainly the time of night and week you might expect something like this to take place.

And you can see the debris that was mentioned in the original article which flew across onto the on-ramp which another car was coming up heading to Fife, but the driver of that car didn't even seem to bat an eyelid Or maybe they didn't even notice the debris

Pity, though, for the driver who crashed, because these annoying lights at the bottom of the ramp just turned green at the right time if he hadn't knackered his car

https://content.jwplatform.com/previews/xudpiVQ0

Certainly going too fast for that bend . Now he has paid for it by losing his license .

YBB, well it will be interesting to see if the press cover their future licensing decisions, which obviously they're hoping will come out in their favour. But we'll see

I'd kind of forgotten that the driver who went straight ahead was the one who was indicating left while they were side-by-side on the main bridge dual carriageway, so obviously they did both intend going down the ramp to the left.

But clearly the driver in the right-hand lane finally decided going straight on was a better bet, for obvious reasons.

Don't know what speed they were doing, precisely, but surprised the driver who crashed didn't make a better attempt at actually going down the ramp, although obviously it's difficult to tell just by the video how difficult it would be. So maybe there was slightly more to it than just excessive speed when he got onto the ramp...

Also surprised there's no mention of actual speeds. I thought that they'd be able to make a fair estimation by timing how long it took them to cover a specific distance in the video, but no evidence of that in the news articles.

Another surprise is that someone seems to be monitoring the camera, and pans and zooms towards the stricken car. I always kind of assume that no-one's actually looking all the time, so will have to bear that in mind

(On the other hand, they may have to keep looking out for potential jumpers walking onto the bridge, or whatever. The bridge is regularly closed for that kind of thing, but obviously not on that particular night )

Today's Courier article with the video is mostly rehash, but contains this, which isn't really how I read things in the original article: "The pair had been accused of racing each other but this was deleted from the charge by Sheriff Gregor Murray."

This Streetview below from a bit further back on the bridge maybe demonstrates why the driver in the right lane decided it was best to go straight ahead.

But apart from all that, I've not really got anything to say about any of this

https://www.google.com/maps/@56.4589648 ... ?entry=ttu