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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 11:24 am 
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JD wrote:
Reverand Jim 69 wrote:
Anyway. To get this back on track. LTI are having a bad time. Hardly news. And hardly a reason for rejoice, more British jobs on the line. And for all their MANY faults they are in the taxi trade for life like most of us. It would be better that we influence them rather than try to hasten their demise. Remember what they would be replaced by......... Equally sh#t companies but without the reliance on the taxi trade for their survival.

Again quoting Captain Cab "careful what you wish for"


I would like to be able to say that the future of Manganese Bronze lies in their own hands but it doesn't, it lies in the hands of the Lord Mayor of London and the few councils who still insist on the turning circle requirement. I have no doubt that after the Liverpool case the turning circle condition but London will no doubt hold out for a court case.

Regards

JD


Just to point out the Lord Mayor of the City of London and the elected mayor of London are two completely different posts and people.

The Lord Mayor of London (Ian Luder)is elected by the City of London (ie about 2 square miles) more information at http://www.cityoflondon.gov.uk/Corporat ... ord_Mayor/
The Mayor of London (Boris Johnson) is elected by the voters of Greater London (about 750 square miles,7,500,000 people and 32 boroughs including the City of London) More information at http://www.london.gov.uk/mayor/index.jsp

As for the turning circle,whilst it is decided ultimately by the mayor,PCO/TfL advise the mayor.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 11:55 am 
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Capt Taxi wrote:
Just to point out the Lord Mayor of the City of London and the elected mayor of London are two completely different posts and people.


I have a sneaking feeling everyone is aware of that.

Regards

JD

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 6:22 pm 
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Manganese seeks government help as cab sales fall


Manganese Bronze, the maker of London’s black cabs, revealed today that it was seeking assistance from the Government after it reported a sharp fall in the sales of taxis and swung to a full year loss.

The company said it had sought financing help from the Government, as part of the car industry's £2.3 billion rescue package, to support its environmental initiatives and mitigate potential additional risk.


Manganese said that risks to the business had increased significantly over the past year when sales fell and financing for cabbies to buy taxis became harder to obtain as the British economy fell into recession and banks clamped down on lending.

The group is also at risk from the loss of key suppliers, with only a single source for almost every component used, which it said could lead to “major funding consequences” if production had to be suspended.

It also cautioned that the restriction of credit from suppliers could have a “marked effect” on its working capital.

The warning came as the group reported a 37.5 per cent fall in annual new vehicle sales from 4,147 units to 1,951 over 17 months, during which time the company changed its reporting period.

Poor sales and challenging economic conditions saw the group slump to a pre-tax loss of £14.2 million over the period to December 31, compared to a previous profit of £4.9 million.

Profits were also hit by writedowns on the value of its used vehicles and redundancy costs, combined with costs associated with the recall of some taxis due to several under bonnet fires.

Manganese has also been forced to axe its final dividend as part of an agreement to renew its overdraft facility.

In an attempt to reduce costs the group said that it had cut 20 per cent of its workforce and stopped production for the equivalent of about six weeks.

It also revealed that from the beginning of February this year all employees, including directors, had agreed a 10 per cent pay cut.

John Russell, chief executive of Manganese Bonze, said that 2008 had been a challenging year, with sales and margins under pressure, and that current trading continues to be adversely impacted by the wider downturn in the automotive market.

The one bright spot for the company is its expansion into China, where commercial production has now started in Shanghai, with indicative orders for 8,000 vehicles.

Manganese shares, which have been hammered over the past year, fell 9p to 58.5p.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 6:51 pm 
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And you heard it all on TDO months and months ago.

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JD

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:00 pm 
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Would you consider buying one of these crap vehicles, with the possible knowledge that they could go under leaving you in the sheit without warranty cover, or not being able to get the parts due to the parts suppliers going under.
The things are over priced by 10K to start with, the radiators need replacing regularly, along with other parts, the biggest one being the automatic gearbox :shock:
The quicker they go under the better


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:02 pm 
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skippy41 wrote:
Would you consider buying one of these crap vehicles, with the possible knowledge that they could go under leaving you in the sheit without warranty cover, or not being able to get the parts due to the parts suppliers going under.
The things are over priced by 10K to start with, the radiators need replacing regularly, along with other parts, the biggest one being the automatic gearbox :shock:
The quicker they go under the better


Yeah....what you all need in the scottish borders are those E7's or mercedes WAV's. :lol:

CC

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:03 pm 
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The quicker they go under the better


I don't know much about them but I would think the prospect of them going under will be far more reaching than whether you can get parts for them. Think of all the people they employ for a start

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:37 pm 
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Other than those directly involved in the making and selling of LTI products the biggest losers would be the taxi/PH trade press.

For many years they have sucked up to LTI just to ensure they get their regular bribes, in terms of advertising revenue. :sad:

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:46 pm 
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skippy41 wrote:
Would you consider buying one of these crap vehicles, with the possible knowledge that they could go under leaving you in the sheit without warranty cover, or not being able to get the parts due to the parts suppliers going under.
The things are over priced by 10K to start with, the radiators need replacing regularly, along with other parts, the biggest one being the automatic gearbox :shock:
The quicker they go under the better



I'm surprised to hear you slagging off Skoda.

So what will be your WAV of choice? E7, Merc or electric Metrocab?

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 8:37 pm 
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I suspect LTI could well be finished by the end of the year. The reason being is that manganese Bronze is relying on the Chinese order book being filled but in todays climate I expect 70% of those tentative orders will be cancelled.

In effect as they stand today Manganese Bronze are bankrupt.

In addition, it would be irresponsible, unreasonable and negligent of any council who is aware of the precarious financial position of manganese bronze, to insist on proprietors buying their vehicles when the company could go into liquidation at anytime. Magistrates knowing all the facts would not ask a proprietor to invest money in a product that they themselves would not invest in, so the end is nigh as far as I'm concerned.

Regards

JD

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 10:08 pm 
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JD wrote:
I suspect LTI could well be finished by the end of the year. The reason being is that manganese Bronze is relying on the Chinese order book being filled but in todays climate I expect 70% of those tentative orders will be cancelled.

In effect as they stand today Manganese Bronze are bankrupt.

In addition, it would be irresponsible, unreasonable and negligent of any council who is aware of the precarious financial position of manganese bronze, to insist on proprietors buying their vehicles when the company could go into liquidation at anytime. Magistrates knowing all the facts would not ask a proprietor to invest money in a product that they themselves would not invest in, so the end is nigh as far as I'm concerned.

Regards

JD



Do you suppose the factory that chucks out the Fiat/Citroen/Peugeot vehicle that is clearly not a van, that is turned into a purpose built taxi by those nice people at cab direct, is in any better financial position than LTI?

Are cab direct and the other "converters" in dire straights too?

Is anyone out there even thinking about a shiny new cab of any persuasion?

Why the schaudenfraud anyway?

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 11:09 pm 
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jimbo wrote:
Are cab direct and the other "converters" in dire straights too?

Quite possibly. :?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 2:07 am 
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JD wrote:
In addition, it would be irresponsible, unreasonable and negligent of any council who is aware of the precarious financial position of manganese bronze, to insist on proprietors buying their vehicles when the company could go into liquidation at anytime. Magistrates knowing all the facts would not ask a proprietor to invest money in a product that they themselves would not invest in, so the end is nigh as far as I'm concerned.


Valid point, JD.

Could any council insisting on LTI vehicles be held liable for any losses incurred by applicants who complied with their rules?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 2:13 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
JD wrote:
In addition, it would be irresponsible, unreasonable and negligent of any council who is aware of the precarious financial position of manganese bronze, to insist on proprietors buying their vehicles when the company could go into liquidation at anytime. Magistrates knowing all the facts would not ask a proprietor to invest money in a product that they themselves would not invest in, so the end is nigh as far as I'm concerned.


Valid point, JD.

Could any council insisting on LTI vehicles be held liable for any losses incurred by applicants who complied with their rules?


Are there any councils that do only allow LTI vehicles to be licenced and if so why has it never been challenged cos surely that would be like creating a monolopy, or did I wake up away with the faries today :D

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 2:36 pm 
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gusmac wrote:
JD wrote:
In addition, it would be irresponsible, unreasonable and negligent of any council who is aware of the precarious financial position of manganese bronze, to insist on proprietors buying their vehicles when the company could go into liquidation at anytime. Magistrates knowing all the facts would not ask a proprietor to invest money in a product that they themselves would not invest in, so the end is nigh as far as I'm concerned.


Valid point, JD.

Could any council insisting on LTI vehicles be held liable for any losses incurred by applicants who complied with their rules?


Negligence might well apply if you can prove the decision to insist on a turning circle requirement that only applies to one type of vehicle that being the LTI type vehicle, not withstanding the fact that the Mercedes vehicle is not yet available in the provinces and blatently ignoring the untenable state of the company in favour of blindly insisting on a historic policy and rigidly being unwilling to depart from that policy in light of the special circumstances, then the door could well be open for a claim of compensation. However one would expect the normal course of appeals to be carried out and in that respect I can't see a magistrates court siding with the council.

Now is the right time for any owner who disagrees with a council policy on the turning circle to challenge it.

I believe the Liverpool case will do away with the turning circle but the plight of Manganese Bronze will greatly add to their case.

Regards

JD

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