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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 10:33 pm 
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Industry bodies warn chauffeurs on the use of hire apps

The use of mobile apps within the Chauffeur and Private Hire industry is being questioned after fears some of them are not legal and any driver downloading one could find themselves uninsured, operating illegally and potentially having their PHV Licence revoked, points on their driving licence and a hefty fine – that’s according to lawyers and major industry trade bodies.

The Licensed Private Hire Car Association (LPHCA) is currently in the midst of lengthy discussions with Transport for London, the Department for Transport and others as it is certain that some apps are categorically breaching not only Private Hire Regulations that cover Minicab, Chauffeur and Executive Drivers and Operators, but are also potentially breaching Taxi regulations.

In the Chauffeur and Executive world, apps can enable customers to book cars, the same applies to taxis, but whilst this is all hi-tech, questions are being asked whether it is legal for the PHV driver and safe for the customer.

The Taxi industry and the Licensed Taxi Drivers Association (LTDA) recently highlighted in its Taxi newspaper that some app providers could be operating in contravention of the laws that regulate the minicab industry.

The LTDA goes on to explain “Some of these apps are in fact ‘metering journeys’ which is absolutely illegal”. Others in the industry have said some apps are effectively ‘street hailing’, which is the domain of taxis only because PHV drivers have not done the ‘Knowledge’ tests that taxi drivers have to undergo to earn the right to become available on the streets.

The LPHCA goes further and a spokesperson told TheChauffeur.com; “PHV Drivers are being seduced into joining a new breed of operators’ that work ‘in the cloud’. Some of these operators in our view are compromising safety because they are not taking the full booking details at the point of booking, which is illegal and has several safety implications.”

“Drivers who receive such bookings via apps are potentially committing a serious offence and compromising themselves and public safety. Operators sit between the travelling public and drivers for good reasons both regulatory and safety. If a driver is found receiving bookings in such a way these app Operators are likely to ‘walk away’ and deny any liability as they have done in the USA citing their terms and conditions.”

The Association is advising any PHV drivers to take caution before downloading and using some very high profile apps. “Drivers should be aware that they may be aiding and abetting illegal activity, which could put them in the dock and not the app provider”, it warns.

Drivers are being urged to contact their local licensing office to make sure they are operating within the law if they are using apps to generate work. Traditional Private Hire Operators, in light of the serious risks of being associated with unlicensed activities, are likely to dismiss any driver found to be working with rogue apps and may even take legal action if such services are found to have been provided within a company vehicle, which may very well become uninsured.

http://www.thechauffeur.com/industry-bo ... hire-apps/

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 10:35 pm 
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I sort of agree with much of the above.

But it's as clear as clear can be, the spivs are being spooked. :-$

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 10:40 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
I sort of agree with much of the above.

But it's as clear as clear can be, the spivs are being spooked. :-$


was kinda of the opinion apps are bad - but now the PH spivs confirm that they are bad for them I'm warming to the idea :lol:

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2014 9:32 am 
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Rest assured the apps providers will get their act together and that spells the death knell of the LPHCA and its crooked members who cheat lie swindle exploit and corrupt the entire industry................................take a look at Ruskin Cars just gone tits up ..................................bogus self employment less than minimum wage .........uninsured vehicles..................LPHCA members ..........................providing SCHOOL TRANSPORT FFS :twisted: :twisted:

LPHCA some of their members. though not all organise ................................EXPLOITATION CHEATING OF DRIVERS .......................STEVE WRIGHT MBE ...................MBE GOT IT #-o #-o


APPS WILL BE THE FUTURE...........................ORGANISED DRIVERS WILL BENEFIT FROM THEM.......................UNORGANISED DRIVERS WILL BE RAPED :D

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2014 1:09 pm 
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The only grey area I find with these apps are metered journeys. Though, in London it is illegal for private hire to be fitted with a "taxymeter" which records the speed and distance to calculate the far, but these apps use GPS technology to work out the fare, not a taxymeter (though you could argue it's a virtual one).

These apps holds the appropriate operator's licence, each booking is logged somewhere in the system - it has to be to enable the customers to be e-mailed a receipt, and the driver to be paid appropriately.

To get work from these apps you still have to submit (copies of) the necessary documents, as with any other operator/s you choose to work for (i.e. V5, MOT, PH driver's licence etc..)


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 8:35 pm 
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christopherwk wrote:
The only grey area I find with these apps are metered journeys.

Every car has got a mileometer, so if the quote £3 start and £2.50 a mile then surely most of us can use a calculator.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 11:04 pm 
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What I meant to say was that these apps use GPS to calculate the fare by measuring the speed, distance and time. The fare is not known until the end of the journey.

As far as I know, private hire bookings in London, the fares are fixed (usually based on distance, unless it's an as directed) and need to be quoted before the journey starts.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 11:26 pm 
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christopherwk wrote:
What I meant to say was that these apps use GPS to calculate the fare by measuring the speed, distance and time. The fare is not known until the end of the journey.

Interesting.

Is there no reason why the calculation can't be done pre customer getting in?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:08 am 
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trotskys twin wrote:
Rest assured the apps providers will get their act together and that spells the death knell of the LPHCA and its crooked members who cheat lie swindle exploit and corrupt the entire industry................................take a look at Ruskin Cars just gone tits up ..................................bogus self employment less than minimum wage .........uninsured vehicles..................LPHCA members ..........................providing SCHOOL TRANSPORT FFS :twisted: :twisted:

LPHCA some of their members. though not all organise ................................EXPLOITATION CHEATING OF DRIVERS .......................STEVE WRIGHT MBE ...................MBE GOT IT #-o #-o


APPS WILL BE THE FUTURE...........................ORGANISED DRIVERS WILL BENEFIT FROM THEM.......................UNORGANISED DRIVERS WILL BE RAPED :D
Why do you have to lump ALL members of the LPHCA together as "crooked". I've been a member of the LPHCA for a few years and strongly object to being classed as a "crooked" member. I suggest you be careful about your rants on here, it could cost you and your union a lot of money if I were to take further action.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:58 pm 
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roythebus wrote:
trotskys twin wrote:
Rest assured the apps providers will get their act together and that spells the death knell of the LPHCA and its crooked members who cheat lie swindle exploit and corrupt the entire industry................................take a look at Ruskin Cars just gone tits up ..................................bogus self employment less than minimum wage .........uninsured vehicles..................LPHCA members ..........................providing SCHOOL TRANSPORT FFS :twisted: :twisted:

LPHCA some of their members. though not all organise ................................EXPLOITATION CHEATING OF DRIVERS .......................STEVE WRIGHT MBE ...................MBE GOT IT #-o #-o


APPS WILL BE THE FUTURE...........................ORGANISED DRIVERS WILL BENEFIT FROM THEM.......................UNORGANISED DRIVERS WILL BE RAPED :D
Why do you have to lump ALL members of the LPHCA together as "crooked". I've been a member of the LPHCA for a few years and strongly object to being classed as a "crooked" member. I suggest you be careful about your rants on here, it could cost you and your union a lot of money if I were to take further action.


i SUGGEST ROY YOU RE READ MY POST...........................FOR SURE SOME LPHCA MEMBERS ARE FAIR AND GENUINE........... :D NO DOUBT THAT INCLUDES YOU :wink:

AS FOR SUING A UNION I SUGGEST YOU READ MY FOOTNOTE................REST ASSURED I REPRESENT NO ORGANISATION WHATSOEVER ALL OPINIONS ARE EXPRESSED IN A PERSONAL CAPACITY :D AND SHOULD NOT BE ASSOCIATED WITH ANY ORGANISATION WHATSOEVER!

lIBEL LAWS PRETTY NASTY THINGS .........................BUT OF COURSE ITS THE PUBLISHER THAT GETS SUED :badgrin: :badgrin:

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 7:13 pm 
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trotskys twin wrote:
lIBEL LAWS PRETTY NASTY THINGS .........................BUT OF COURSE ITS THE PUBLISHER THAT GETS SUED :badgrin: :badgrin:

Pretty sure on the internet the site admin can pass the buck by giving the authorities the IP addresses of the bad guys.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:35 pm 
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Sussex wrote:
trotskys twin wrote:
lIBEL LAWS PRETTY NASTY THINGS .........................BUT OF COURSE ITS THE PUBLISHER THAT GETS SUED :badgrin: :badgrin:

Pretty sure on the internet the site admin can pass the buck by giving the authorities the IP addresses of the bad guys.


Probab;y :lol: :lol: but of course not much point going for libel against someone who aint got 2 bob is it, and lives in a council house :badgrin: :badgrin: 8) 8) :lol: :lol:

plenty learnt that lesson :badgrin: :badgrin: :badgrin:


LPHCA most members i have dealt with are VERMIN in my opinion :D some are good people who i have frequently got on the gargle with :wink:

Bring on the APPS .....................send the VERMIN bankrupt =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 9:39 am 
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I suspect the reason some operators are against these apps is because it diminishes their grip over drivers who pay them rent - its quite amusing because PH Operators spent a great deal of time convincing the Law Commission of advances in technology rendering legislation useless and its this same technology which will lead to their downfall.

Why pay a PH Operator when you can subscribe to a app?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 10:08 am 
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I'd sooner pay a few quid per week to use an app than £200 to a baron.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 10:11 am 
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Nidge2 wrote:
I'd sooner pay a few quid per week to use an app than £200 to a baron.



Bleedin right ............................some of em down here .............................they STINK =D> =D> =D>

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