Taxi Driver Online

Thanks Sussex,

Am I right in thinking that HC's must have the meter running regardless? or is that just fictional BS I have picked up somewhere?

Cheers

Pete

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More than likely.

That said, it's worth noting that a few councils don't have set fares, so it's not explicit in the acts.

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IDFIMH

Well, Jamie owens is a licensed London Cab driver and Wedding Taxis ltd use licensed London cabs and drivers. They charge a minimum fee and also by the hour. We can't forget the law here now can we? The law states a licensed hackney carriage is always hackney carriage until such time it is not licensed. So to recap, you say I can't charge for an unconventional hire of a house removal and under the same logic Jamie Owens can't charge for his unconventional hire of a wedding?

Very Interesting.



That would constitute a conventional hire would it not? I'll let you know what Gateshead say about unconventional hires tomorrow.

Regards

JD

I did say that I was unaware of the dispensations ............... didn't I.

I say this because some of my members work under a PH contract at Newcastle Airport.

Airport Taxis have applied to Gateshead Council for dispensation to allow Gateshead Licensed vehicles to operate on a higher tariff whilst working at the airport ............... which was granted.

Maybe Jamie and the other people have applied for dispensation, or there is something within their by-laws which allows extra charges for specific types of work.

What you have so blatantly failed to understand is that I actually accept the fact that extra charges can be made if the local by-laws state they can be made and that in cases where no extra charges apply to the specific work being undertaken dispensation can be given to legally allow that person to charge their preferred rate.

I doubt very much that an area which prescribes tariffs would allow the licence holder to charge whatever they want for doing anything other than what you loosely describe as a conventional hire without notice or approval.

B. Lucky

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"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

I wonder what motivates you to go to the trouble you do to discredit anyone who offers an alternative viewpoint.

Exactly how knowing what the situation in Gateshead could possibly be of any benefit to someone from Cheshire is something you may like to clarify because it is not immediatly apparent.

B. Lucky

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"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

I don't see how you can substantiate or justify the extra charge you would make for undertaking the hiring ................ do you dress your car for removals ........... do you wear a suit and cap ............... do you wait outside until the customer has completed the move and then take them onto another location for a party and then very possibly return when the party ends to take them home.

Come on JD ..................... there is absolutely NO comparison or justification of your statements.

B. Lucky

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"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

The point you raised is that the charge for an unconventional private hiring for a house removal must be no greater than the prescribed fare. Now you are saying that a private hire contract to transport two people in a licensed vehicle from A to B can be charged at a higher rate? So what is the law? Where in the 1847 or 1976 act does it say a Taxi driver can charge what he likes if his vehicle is hired to take the bride or groom to Church? And if a Taxi driver can charge what he likes to hire out both himself and his vehicle, then surely the type of occasion is irrelevant?

Regards

JD

The law would state that the prescribed tariff is the maximum that can be charged.

However as you pointed out councils can amend through by-laws and allow extra charges OR allow dispensation.

You are complicating a very simple question, in your normal way.

I very much doubt that PeteG wishes to go into the removals business or carry anything other than people ................. otherwise he would have included something within his question.

B. Lucky

_________________
"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

We had a similar discussion a few weeks ago, and one of the main issues that was raised was a taxi based in a small town being asked to go five miles out of town to do a one mile job then drive six miles back, which it clearly wouldn't do on the metered rate.

I think this is a grey area, but in my manor these trips are quoted at more than the metered fare, and I think the counci's view is that such trips are effectively private hire, thus if the fare is agreed then there's not a problem.

Perhaps the salient point is that while under normal circumstances a HC must undertake a public hiring, there is absolutely not obligation to do a pre-booked job, thus many hirings like the one I described above would simply not be undertaken if the HC could only charge the metered rate.

Thus in principle at least it seems to me that there's no problem with allowing HCs to charge more than the set tariff if the fare is agreed in advance; otherwise, the customer wouldn't get service.

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Taxi Driver Online
www.taxi-driver.co.uk

That reminds me of a story from a works night out a couple of years ago in Liverpool. It was the end of the night and we were staying in the crown plaza in the city centre.

We had some Cristal drinking fairies with us who were business associates from down south, clearly they had more money than sense because they came out of the club we had been in and were trying to get a taxi back to the hotel (they were worried about hanging around outside because they had heard that everyone from Liverpool goes round head butting people in the street... ) So they approached a driver who refused them explaining that it was not worth it... it was less than 2 minutes walk. Being the flash ba$t@r9s they were offered the driver £100 notes to take them back to the hotel, whom I'm quite sure graciously accepted. When they rolled in 3 of them laughing their heads off, 2 of them looking very miffed, they explained that the taxi had just driven them less than 200 yards round the corner and had cost them £100! Those of us who were already back at the hotel bar... Well you can imagine... we ripped it out of them... but... is what the driver did illegal?

I would say from Joe public's view point... why should it be... a driver must have the right to refuse anyone don't they? And if they are offered different terms or demand different terms... is this not acceptable to both parties?

Irrelevant I know... but a situation that gave me a chuckle at the time! And I'm quite sure made someones night

Cheers

Pete

ps. As always, thanks TDO for the input!

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Well Pete, as you tell the story the driver was taking the pi$$ big time and was acting illegally.

If a taxi is approached on a rank then the basic rule is that the driver must take the fare, and can charge no more than the set tariff, provided that the journey ends within the council area. However, there are one or two exceptions to this rule, for example if the passenger is drunk or his clothes are soiled. In practice this rule isn't really taken advantage of (it's still at the driver's discretion) since clearly many taxi passengers are drunk, and if a driver knocked back any fare that he simply didn't like the look of then it would upset the other drivers. By the same token, if the rules didn't compel drivers to take short fares, for example, then the customer might not be able to find a cab at all - if I've waited an hour on the rank then if I get a two pound run at the end of it then obviously I would prefer to wait for another few minutes in the hope of getting a decent fare, but if we were allowed to do this then it would clearly be against the public interest and would cause conflict between drivers.

If a taxi is flagged I think the rules are basically the same, but I'm not sure if the driver is compelled to stop if flagged, but once he's stopped I think the situation is effectively the same as on the ranks.

As for pre-booked jobs, as per what was said earlier it seems to be a bit of a grey area legally, but in practice there's no real obligation to undertake any job, and HC circuits can charge what the want as long as it's agreed in advance.

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Taxi Driver Online
www.taxi-driver.co.uk

Pete overcharging only occurs when an amount greater than the metered fare is demanded or requested.

The driver retains the right to refuse a hiring (justification poss required) and if offered more then the metered fare to undertake the journey the excess has not been requested so would constitute a tip.

B. Lucky

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"Here's a simple solution. If you don't want to pay more for a premium service then wait in the queue, problem solved".
Skull on TDO

TF pi$$ed on his chips.

But in the circumstances described it was prima facie a case of the driver refusing the job because it was too short, thus the money proffered can hardly be justified on the basis that he didn't demand it.

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Taxi Driver Online
www.taxi-driver.co.uk

TDO,

I take your point, but I do think from memory (where I put "refused" earlier it was the wrong word) the driver was merely trying to explain that it was just around the corner and a drive was therefore unnecessary. That is what was causing the 3 people with them so much side splitting laughter, because it really was, just around the corner. Knowing the individual in question, he will have been flashing the cash and deserved to have it lifted for being an idiot. But I do take you point, had he refused and then accepted for the offer of money, which is obviously a fine line, he would have been acting inappropriately.

But then did I not see something on the news recently about "Cherry Picking" in ranks? Is that not the same offence?

Cheers

Pete

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That's right, but I think it was longer runs that the drivers didn't want in the cherry picking story?

Anyway, it's usually the longer or shorter runs that the drivers don't like, but it depends on the circumstances. I mean, really short runs can be quite lucrative if flagged down, but not if you've spent an hour sitting on the rank.

However, I see what you mean about your story. But a lot depends on the circumstances. For example, I've heard drivers tell punters that a short job is closer than it actually is, merely because they don't want to do the run, and they clearly think that if they're insistent with a wavering passenger then the passenger will be persuaded not to take a taxi. The driver doesn't actually say that he won't do the job, but it's as good as a refusal.

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Taxi Driver Online
www.taxi-driver.co.uk